Sophie Thatcher knows what you think about her. She’s seen the headlines and social media posts. She’s dark. Maybe it’s the acting choices, like Natalie, her tortured teen on “Yellowjackets,” or an abducted missionary in “Heretic,” or the enslaved robot girlfriend in “Companion.” Perhaps it’s her Mormon upbringing, which she believes has fostered “a feeling of repression that has leaked into all of my characters.” (Thatcher left the LDS Church when she was 12.) Or is it her penchant for punk rock music and gothic fashion? Whatever it is, in conversation, the 25-year-old Chicago native comes off warm and witty, a far cry from her icy cool onscreen persona.
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The occasion for our talk is a fun one: “Her Private Hell,” a hypnotic and seductive future-horror film from Nicolas Winding Refn (“Drive”), his first movie in a decade. Thatcher plays Elle, a glamorous movie star in a neo-Tokyo high-rise navigating cringy co-stars (Kristine Froseth) and an absentee father (Dougray Scott) married to her ex (Havana Rose Liu), all while a supernatural serial killer known as the Leather Man — who may have abducted the young daughter of Private K (Charles Melton) — closes in on her. With nods to Argento and De Palma, Refn’s latest is one bold, bloody mindfuck, held together by Thatcher’s magnetism and restraint.
Variety spoke with Thatcher via Zoom — she’s in Vancouver shooting the fourth and final season of “Yellowjackets” — to discuss “Her Private Hell” and so much more.
Where are you right now?
I’m in Vancouver, actually. I’ve got three days left on “Yellowjackets” and then I’m free. Freeeeeee!!
One of my former colleagues did a book on the history of “The O.C.” and by the third season everyone wanted off the show because they’d outgrown it age-wise and also wished to pursue other projects. Has that been your mentality with “Yellowjackets?”
Yeah. And this is nothing to the writers or anything, but I personally feel a bit stunted having to play the same character. And I’m relying on a lot of — I keep saying this, and it’s not necessarily true, maybe it’s just acting — cheat codes. Last night, filming until 6 a.m. screaming and crying, the fact that I can get into that so fast without any… It feels less challenging. Just playing somebody younger is confusing, and staying in that place you were at when you first filmed the pilot seven years ago is a very confusing thing, and that’s what messed with me the most. I want to continue to grow, but then I have to go back to where I was when I was a kid.
I enjoyed “Her Private Hell.” What are your thoughts on how polarizing it’s been? I’m always excited when I hear that a film has polarized audiences.
I loved it. I don’t want it to be exclusive, but it does feel like it is kind of for an audience that if you know these ‘70s films, and you know some of the references it’s pulling from, it feels so satisfying and gratifying. That’s how I felt watching it because anything ‘70s horror, like Brian De Palma, Kenneth Anger, is so in my wheelhouse. It’s a lot weirder and more avant-garde and abstract than people are expecting because the storyline isn’t linear at all. Sometimes you have to let yourself go and immerse yourself in the world and maybe you don’t know what’s going on! It’s a trip. I like that it’s polarizing because that means it’s affecting people. I don’t want to be safe or boring. This movie, I understand why people won’t like it. I totally get it. It’s about keeping an open mind — and being down, mainly.
There’s so much groupthink and following the flock these days.
And I’m also coming to realize, and this happens a lot with movies — you think about cult classics, too, and I’m not saying this will be a cult classic — but they have their initial reaction and sometimes it takes a little to digest and actually form your own opinion. There is that mentality now where people are just so quick to come to conclusions because somebody else is feeling that way and they want to be safe.
The fashion looks are fantastic in the film. Is it weird for you to be considered a style icon at 25?
Everything is like a costume to me. It’s just about playing new characters, and it depends on what phase I’m in in life, but I think I’m very influenced by the ‘60s. Nic is so obsessed with rock ‘n’ roll and we wanted to find a happy medium, so it was a lot of glam-rock influences like Marc Bolan, David Bowie, Roxy Music and a young Brian Eno. Leaning on that was fun because it’s so theatrical. I’ve always been so theatrical that of course I’m going to tap into that. It’s character-building and you have full control and can do anything you want. And with fashion, I know exactly what I want and I’m never going to let other people tell me what I want.
There’s a particularly wild sex scene in “Her Private Hell” involving an exploding body. I’m curious what it was like to film that because there is a lot going on in that sequence, and I don’t think I’ve ever seen a sex scene that incorporates an exploding body before.
I watched it and was like, “Thank god it worked!” Pino [Donaggio, the composer] tied everything together. He elevated it in a way that became larger than life. It was already in the script written that way, but I couldn’t quite visualize it and I didn’t know how it was going to reach that climax and feel satisfying and not gratuitous. With everything, you never knew how it’s going to play. Day by day, we’d not really know what we were going to go into within the day and just see what Nic had dreamed that night. It wasn’t like improvising or anything, but scenes would change. He was like, “I have this idea for the ending,” so he changed the ending a bunch and me and Dom’s relationship really changed.
You and Havana Rose Liu must have gotten along famously since you filmed another movie, “Peaches,” together. Did you meet on “Her Private Hell?”
Yeah. We relied on each other so much. She’s so smart, so in tune and such a giving actor. I really look up to her and it’s nice to feel when you’re working with an actor like they’re consistently elevating you. I had called her for a second and she was like, “I don’t know you, but what do you think about this script? Should I do it?” And I was like, “Yes. Do it.” I always knew she was cool, and then we had this experience and worked really hard on trying to make the characters as layered as possible, changing dialogue here and there and adding little intricacies and nuances that weren’t in the script. And then we had the opportunity two months later to do the “Peaches” movie, which is a retelling of “Daisies.” The script is so light in comparison to this so we were like, “We both need this. Let’s do this as a favor to ourselves.”
But that proved difficult to me because I’m not used to playing light. I want to explore that more and not always have to lean into darkness to feel something, or to feel satisfied, like, “I went to the darkest place, now I can breathe”; to live in a light spot and feel OK and not feel like I’m searching for something deeper. It’s OK to be light. I would leave set confused because I didn’t unleash everything, but I have to learn how to deal with that because that’s real life. That’s what I’m looking for in films now, is to be more grounded.
Do you wonder why you’ve become a go-to person for darker roles? Are you like, “Why do they think of me for these? I have moments of lightness too!”
Yeah, and I think people see it when they meet me! But a lot of article headlines are like, “Sophie Thatcher Is Comfortable in Darkness,” and I’ve probably said it, but you didn’t hear me say it, and it was probably with a smile on my face! Things are misconstrued. I think there’s this persona that they’ve put out because of my taste, and music is such a big thing to me, and musically I can lean more toward the operatic or melancholy, so I think people assume. But day-to-day I’m pretty enthusiastic and on set I’m like, “Let’s keep it light!” It does make sense though because I can lean into that like a switch. I wish it wasn’t so easy; it’s just the parts that I’ve been playing. So, it makes sense to me that this is how people see me.
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Have you seen “Obsession?” There are a number of similarities between Inde Navarrette’s character in that and yours in “Companion.”
I haven’t! I think Inde’s so cool and I really look up to her. I’ve seen clips online and I love that she’s a gamer and, like, normal. Everyone is telling me that so I’m excited to see it and I’m flattered because that movie is very highly-regarded right now.
How do you want to balance your singing and acting careers?
That’s the biggest question right now. It’s just trying to figure out when I have a month off. I wrap “Yellowjackets” in a week and a half, and then I have a month off and I’m starting a project with my friend Maral/May. We’ve been making music and it’s kind of punk. She does all the beats and they’re really hard, and then I’ll do these spoken-word things over it. I’m trying to draw parallels to digital hardcore music, like there’s this band Lolita Storm. It’s very much about the feminine experience and it’s dark. We’ve only made seven or eight songs, but I think we’re going full-on with that. She’s been my biggest supporter and is so talented, so I’m excited.
You’ve said that “Twitter is evil” and I’m wondering what about it is so off-putting to you?
I don’t know. I think there’s a feeling that people can say whatever they want — and that’s all throughout the internet, but there’s something specifically within Twitter where people feel entitled to. Anytime I think of Twitter I just think of Donald Trump, which makes me [choking sound]. It’s just a lot of hate. Anytime I go on there, it’s hate, and I don’t need that. And I don’t need to see hate on myself either and I can’t avoid seeing stuff about myself because of the algorithm, so I don’t need to see what other people think of me because it’s going to mess me up further.
You’ve spoken up about what’s happening in Gaza. We’ve seen other actors in the early stages of the assault on Gaza be pilloried for speaking out, and now there are more people doing it, but what made you want to voice your opinion publicly?
I feel like, for my part, there’s nothing for me to lose. You know, me over somebody’s life? My career doesn’t matter over a life. Who cares about that? That was my initial thought. I have a younger audience that’s impressionable, so if I can help shift their opinions or sway their opinions, that’s all I can do. And posting is nothing. You have to go further and donate and protest, but posting is the bare minimum.
What was it like growing up Mormon? There are a lot of rules you need to adhere to.
Oh yeah, definitely rules. And there’s a feeling of repression that has leaked into all of my characters. Even in “Her Private Hell” she’s going against something, and I think in life, too, I’m playing against something. But there’s also such a beautiful sense of community. You have to lean on community — you need people surrounding you and can’t do things by yourself — and I have that within my family. My twin is my best friend, and I feel like I don’t need friends because I have my twin! My boyfriend, and having that, is really beautiful. I feel like people don’t talk about this a lot, but Mormons are very creative and musical.
Ryan Gosling grew up Mormon.
There you go! It’s “So You Think You Can Dance!” Everybody on that is Mormon. Everybody! My mom still plays the organ for the church choir, so it brought up a musical sensibility within me. There are also a lot of positives. I like to focus on the positives now because I spent a lot of time talking about it doing “Heretic” press, and I love a lot of my family. Although I don’t agree with much of what the religion says, it really brings out a lot of good, honest, true people, and I stand by that.
Have you watched “The Secret Lives of Mormon Wives?”
I can’t! I tried watching it and it was too social media-y. I was like, I don’t care about TikTok. And it made me really anxious. But I’ve heard amazing things. Maybe give me a couple more years and I’ll be obsessed with it.
What are some seminal music acts for you and what are you listening to now?
I’ve said this before, but Blonde Redhead. “Misery Is a Butterfly” is one of my favorite records. They were my first live show, and I still feel like they’ve had the biggest impact on me. I last saw them at Zebulon like two years ago. Let me pull up my Spotify… Royal Trux is probably my favorite band right now. I convinced the people on “Yellowjackets” to allow me to wear a Royal Trux shirt. I said, “Natalie would have good taste, and this is what she’d be into.” Martin Rev always. I’ve mentioned Suicide a lot in this press run because I was listening to it 24/7. There’s this artist John Bender that makes electronic music and I want to lean into more drum machine-type stuff like John Bender.
What do you have up next? Is the Jennifer Kent movie happening?
It will. It got moved, and that’s what always happens with indie movies. That’s going to be insane. I’m playing two roles. I don’t even know how to describe it. I have at least three different movies that I’m signed on to that don’t have dates yet, and that’s really confusing because I’m reaching a point where I don’t have “Yellowjackets” to rely on. And I bought a house.
Congratulations.
Thank you! I’m in Upstate New York now. I was in LA and realized LA wasn’t for me at this point, and I want to be removed enough from New York City and maybe go there on the weekends. I think it was just, “OK, let’s end this chapter of my life and let’s move on.” I want to go more into this project with my friend Maral and make more music. If I have time off, I just want to focus on stuff that isn’t for anyone else and just for me, and do movies with directors I admire, like Jennifer Kent. I want to do something that’s not in my safe zone.
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